Street Culture in 2010. Taking Stock.
The past week was, gratefully, spent talking to a few colleagues in this industry, as well as watching some great documentaries on music and youth culture. Most interesting was a long lunch with a friend of mine who works at the very large online / mail order retailer, Frontline, here in Hamburg. I guess you could say he is their main buyer an he has been with the company for nearly as long as they have been around, which will be 25 years next year. What makes these conversations so interesting is that Marc is maybe even more of a music nerd than I, with a great interest in hardcore, straight edge, heavy metal. More so, I genuinely respect him for his insights into youth culture /trends and being able to turn them into a very profitable business.
The documentaries I watched were “hype!” which chronicles the rise of the grunge scene in Seattle from 82 to 96 and more importantly the relationship and impact the scene had with the global press. The other was “American Hardcore” which I am sure most of you know, but if you haven’t seen it, do watch it. I will get back to those later.
Now, Marc and I talked in detail about trends, retailing, buying and youth culture in relationship to these points as well as music. The conversation raised a lot of great points that I will try and share here, even though I fear I won’t be able to reconnect all the dots from Friday. I blame 20 years of street culture for the loss of brain cells.
The first point we talked about is how street wear has not only killed itself off, but additionally failed at becoming the “next big thing” as well as the fact that the corporate re-interpretation of streetwear has not been the big money maker it initially promised itself to be a. Looking back on it, 2002/2003 really saw the emergence of modern streetwear as we know it today. Let’s, for once, forget about the few brands and stores that paved the way in the 80s and 90s because quite frankly, their models, lessons and aesthetics are actually irrelevant to this movement. I can’t be bothered to write down an all inclusive list of brands from that time period but I am sure we all know what and whom I am talking about here.
Initially, it all looked as if the streetwear movement from that time was going to be big, and I not only mean big as a globally influential youth culture movement with it’s own set of moral, cultural and ethical standards but also big in terms of money. Big enough that in 10-20 years time, those people behind the successful companies could retire in the same style as a certain Mr. Stussy did back in the late 90s. I have written about this before, but to paraphrase it, what made any previous youth cultural movement, including clothing, globally successful and relevant were certain amount of interlocking facts. These are: a moral code not to fuck your friends, i.e blood is thicker than water, i.e. not ethically and morally selling out. Secondly, and this was key to the success of previous youth cultural movements commercially, keeping your distribution really tight. That means, supporting the right independent stores, not going into the mainstream retailers, and only making your product available in select outlets. Previous to 2003, this wasn’t a sales strategy but a fact of life that only a select number of people would actually want your niche product and only a select number of retailers and would and could actually sell your gear.
Now, before 2003 it was generally accepted that if you did make anything relevant to a niche, regardless of music, art, clothing etc, chances were you weren’t going to be millionaire. That was fine, that’s the price you paid for being able to do your thing. Freedom reigned supreme over being rich.
For the first couple of years, I would dare say up until 2007 streetwear looked really promising as it’s participants were generally following said guidelines. Distribution was kept tight, and the global community respected & supported each other, creatively and commercially. Then this financial crisis came. Now, in the previous incarnation of this blog a lot of our community members talked at great length about this and I am not going to get into detail about all that now, but rest assured, I think the mental crisis that accompanied the real life financial crisis that hit us all, went into a total different direction than anticipated by us all. The end result and where we are now is, that all principals that made this movement promising went out the window in the last 3 years and have destroyed the foundation of it, and thus, relegated all chances of this movement to be truly successful.
Looking at what Marc said, as a buyer who firmly believed in streetwear and was willing to support it with large amounts of money and integrity, he has all but given up on it, not only on the independent creative results but also on the corporate interpretations of it. Mostly, because independents have sold out, morally, ethically and most importantly, distribution wise. In his words and I agree with them, the streetwear community falsely started believing it’s own hype that it was a global, both terms of it’s definition and in monetary terms, movement. It wasn’t and now it never will be. Greed got the better of all of us and before you knew it, everyone was selling previously hard to get gear and that took the appeal from it. Furthermore, the ethical standards prerequisite to previous movements such as hardcore, straight edge and to a certain degree grunge were totally ignored, not only by us, but also by those corporates trying to emulate and cash in on the movement. What I mean is that community gave up on itself and that all intellectual and genuine integrity was sold off to the highest bidder.
In retail reality this meant that both the indies and the majors started selling to everyone as the fear of losing money and facing the reality that we are a niche group, started threatening our imaginary empires. This resulted in a lot of genuine first time supporters in retail going broke, as well as a lot of the genuine large retailers loosing faith in the scene. We all lost in the end.
We lost creativity because we sold out. We lost the community because we were greedy. We lost our claim to be influential by selling to everyone in the hope of making a quick buck.
That’s the reality of it. Anyone still clinging onto the notion that streetwear and hence street culture is important on a grand scale really needs to wake up, or more importantly I think, start to realize that it is a niche sub culture, one that can be really fulfilling IF, and only if, you start to accept the fact that you will never be the next Jay-Z or Mark Ecko. Once we realize that there is a genuine positivity that stems out of a community built on respect, hard work, good ethics and creativity we might just all start to have fun again. Because as I see it now, no one in this subculture is having fun.
So what next?
With all this somewhat philosophical talk of utopia the harsh economic reality needs to be addressed nonetheless. My first point is, if you want to stay in this niche culture don’t expect to make a lot of money. Ever. If you do want to work in fashion, go and work in fashion, for one of the big players: Nike, Adidas if you are into sportswear, or the VF group if you are into action sports / denim fashion. If you are good enough and willing to accept the corporate cultures then you can have a go at making a living in this world. Otherwise, flat out forget it. No one in independent streetwear will ever become rich. That’s a fact.
Secondly, after speaking to Marc whose job it is to identify the next big thing to make money of, my opinion was and is that there never again will be a global trend that you can make real money off. Coming back to the documentaries I watched this week, Grunge, was the last, serious global youth culture movement from which people made REAL money. Not Techno/House Music, no one gave a shit about that outside of Europe. Not Brit Pop, again, outside of England and Scandinavia, no one really cared. Skateboarding to a certain degree but that was there way before Grunge, and also, there are more grunge fans in the Middle East then there are skateboarding fans. Still to this day. Now, Grunge got sold out, but cleverly so, by Sub Pop and their control of the then influential Melody Maker and more importantly MTV. MTV in 1991 was the only global youth culture source. More importantly, and unlike today, it’s content was not user generated. Nirvana had a GLOBAL average air time of 8 videos an hour, 7 days a week for over 2 years with a global audience of fuck knows how many people. Think about that.
And if you think this newish trend of vintage menswear is big, you’re fooled. Truly, take a walk around with open eyes and critically asses what the general public out there wears and then compare it to what you see on the blogs. And then think back to 1992 and try and remember how many Nirvana T-Shirts, nay, Flannels you saw, because of Grunge.
The web 2.0 has destroyed any hope of ever again creating a truly global trend, especially in commercial terms. In essence, what the web 2.0 has done is given every niche an equal right of existence. Democracy at it’s finest. Unfortunately, that system does not work with the old way of making money. Now, it might well be that the old way of generating income in a trend based industry is no longer valid, and that’s an interesting point all together, but the economic reality of it is, it’s still there and it’s getting hammered by this. By given every niche an equal chance at exposure, the market share subsequently is getting divided by many more people. What most brands and marketeters don’t realize is that, even though the internet promises you an unlimited amount of potential buyers, in reality it doesn’t. The same amount of buyers exist now, then they have 20 years ago. The difference is, through the democratization of the internet, you now have 100 people/brands/blogs/ideas fighting for the same buyer.
Which, in a romanticized world is great, because it gives everyone a pop, however, the stark reality is that we are all losing out, this time economically. More choice also equals less money for everyone. That means, and I am sure you can all agree with this, we all have to work a lot harder just to stay in the same spot. I now, for example, work twice as many hours a week than my father did, for half the money. That has nothing to do with inflation by the way. Fact is, because of choice, we all loose out. Even the big wigs have to fight harder, and as the last crisis has shown us, our jobs in this industry are by no means safe.
Concluding, there will never again be a global trend to cash in on.Positive or negative, I don’t know. We need to learn to accept the fact that street culture and hence street wear is a niche movement. Furthermore, in order to repair the damage no one but ourselves has done, we need to go back and come up with a set of ethical & moral guidelines acceptable to us all and live by them. When we started selling out to the next big whig for a few grand, we destroyed everything. Now, I am not saying, don’t do this and don’t work for that guy, that’s a personal decision everyone has to make for themselves, but how about we start thinking before selling out. Does Pepsi really need a cool street artist? Does Gillette need advertising on the Complex Media Network? How does McDonalds fit into all this? I don’t think they have a place in our culture at all. Taking the long road is often harder, but if unified it’s easier. If we all accept the fact that what we put into this sub culture, is what we get out, maybe we can all start having fun again.
Really interesting read but nothing most of us don’t already know.
I think the influence of the internet has had a much bigger effect on the sub culture than you have mentioned.
Im a frustrated 26 year old who is just old enough to remember how good street wear was and also young enough to see how we are controlled by what we are fed from the internet. We are told everyday that we CAN be the next Jay-Z or the next ‘preme. And when we try then fail there are another 100 people who will follow the same path into failure, thus the cycle continues.
The internet is still a baby and what is to come no one knows. We can all complain and throw out answers based on nothing but what the forefathers did. But truth is pioneers and revolutionaries don’t exist in a world where we’ve gotta beg for change. We’ve become accustomed to wanting everything yesterday, never being satisfied and also thinking the individual is the centre of the universe. What we need to do is get passionate, enjoy learning, take a trade and aim to be the best. Not cut anymore corners because this square is already a circle and as you said….no one is having fun anymore.
Ollie Danger
27 Sep 10 at 3:56 pm
There are a lot of brands with the opinion that they are or can become, as you said, the next Jay-Z or Mark Ecko. And a lot of them, are spending a lot of money promoting that image. Can it be sustained? It’s not likely. But for every say 10 brands like that, there’s at least 1 doing something interesting (interesting to me at least) and having fun doing it. Hopefully it’s only a matter of time before the ones that want the riches realize it won’t happen and they move on.
Derek Gusikoski
27 Sep 10 at 5:40 pm
this will cheer u up. http://www.t-shirt-party.co.uk
jameson
27 Sep 10 at 6:36 pm
[...] The rest of the piece can be read here. [...]
[PICS] POP*CULTURE NEWS » Black Lodges: Street Culture in 2010
27 Sep 10 at 7:40 pm
Well put post Steven. You’ve said many things that have been on many minds that haven’t gotten around to saying or gathered together.
Now back to having fun.
~Lefty
LeftyJeenyus
27 Sep 10 at 7:44 pm
I left an upcoming brand for these exact reasons. They forgot what streetwear represented and wanted to make that quick buck. Lost the integrity of the brand and customers see that. What these brands tend to realize is that customers can sense when you are selling out. The only way to get back to having fun, is by not watching what the big boys do. Things changed, they used to watch us. Once we began watching them, we lost the vision, once lost control of the wheel and drifted off the road. I realize, change begins with me and I want it back. I miss it, and it is not about the $$ with me. It is really for the love of Streetwear… FOR THE LOVE…
Darrell Peacock
27 Sep 10 at 8:54 pm
[...] Steven Vogel – Street Culture in 2010. Taking Stock. [...]
Street Culture in 2010 « now | worldwidewestern
27 Sep 10 at 9:02 pm
[...] Black Lodges gives their opinion on what is going on in Street Culture. I have similar feelings as what they mentioned in their post. The Street Culture grew to big to fast. Product placement became an issue. Hard to find brands were placed everywhere. Sad thing about that, majority of those brands all folded. Street Culture lost its authenticity within this process. I understand why they took certain approaches to grow and gain greater finances, I mean, in the business at the end of the day, if it does not make money, it does not make sense. Now let us look from a customer’s perspective. As a customer to Street Culture, I love to buy something that I exclusively have. I know I will not be the only person with it, but it will not be all over the streets. I lost my love for Nike because of that reason. Nike began to mass produce everything. No more limited edition sneakers, that you have to search for. The internet is already making everything easier to get but when you mass produce and place every product in every single store, you lose its essence. This is just my opinion. Check out what Black Lodges as to say about this situation here. [...]
My Thoughts – Black Lodges: Street Culture in 2010 « DP
27 Sep 10 at 9:49 pm
[...] rest of the piece can be read here. Categories: Culture Tags: Fashion, Print [...]
Black Lodges: Street Culture in 2010 | Hypebeast
27 Sep 10 at 11:29 pm
[...] over to Black Lodges to read the [...]
Street Culture in 2010. Taking Stock. « Project 4000 – Shut Up & Read
28 Sep 10 at 12:45 am
Great piece Steve!
JB
28 Sep 10 at 1:16 am
I must say that this article really, how should I put it, moved me. I got into the whole streetwear thing because it so much resembled the hardcore scene of which I’ve been a part of half my life (I’m now 26). The independet spirit and almost an “d.i.y” ethic and apporach made me really attracked to it. While it’s fun that the brands can reach a broader audience, it feels sad when brands over expands.
I think the beginning of the Warzone (old New York hardcore band)song, “Don’t forget the struggle, don’t forget the streets” really do apply to the streetwear scene:
“In our minds and in our hearts, we feel that hardcore music should stay out of big business and stay in the streets where it belongs. All you kids out there, ALWAYS KEEP THE FAITH!”
Henrik
28 Sep 10 at 2:01 am
Working hard in any industry and finding the time to analyse it and share is always commendable. Often stopping for a while when on a journey helps clarify things and point you in the correct direction, not always the end point on a map. From what I can gather from our rather pathetic street market here in the UK, it’s such a moment. The relationship between street-wear and culture for me is defined by a single moment. When street-wear became clothing.
The internet serves only one clothing genre well, street-wear. It was never about touch, fit, quality. These were superseded by, hype, statement, originality, graphic prowess and attitude. This factor alone has helped the unbelievable acceleration of information and accessibility that has ultimately burst the bubble we watched expand. Another factor surely has to be the age of the people involved, we all know as we shuffle through life our attitudes change, this is true of even the forefathers, success for a few and the taste shift the comes with it can affect every tier below in terms of what the aspirations of the up and coming can and should be. The guys I know in the Global industry all seam to have gone through this need to re-establish, to change ( evolve?) things to a point where suddenly touch is an essential ingredient in what they do.
There is a parallel right now with what is going on in the heritage theme park that is our current trend, a series of magically historic rides staffed by spotty youths who for them the world inside there tiny blinkers is definitive and they WILL be defined by it as long as they live, of course what they don’t realise yet is the are just succumbing to trend, a bit of experience or a decade of real life will show this to be the case.
So we should lead not follow. The basics are thus. The domestic Japanese street scene is greatly admired, retailed to perfection under a back drop of behind the scenes investment and licensing. All well and good but make no mistake there is nothing organic about it. Even the word Organic fits only one genre in terms of attitude, Street wear. We can all argue that it means different things to what ever passport you may hold, and well it does. But it will and should always be about originality. If you are smart then you can still make $$, one has to always believe that good ideas sell, or rather that people will always be interested in good ideas. Without that basic principal we all should just coverall up and be done with it.
No one ever remembers who came second, sure some asshole who came third will steal everything rape every last $ out of it. But it’s the guy who came from no where, the unexpected winner that steals the show.
The final moment can be replicated.
The journey to it has to be different.
Ian
28 Sep 10 at 10:17 am
Thanks for all the comments people, I am really happy that it prompted some sort of discourse, if not at least thought.
two points.
@ollie danger. you are right. there should have been more emphasis on the social effect of the internet, both on buyers and consumers. I have talked about this in the past so maybe that’s why I left it out, but it should be included.
@Ian also, good point, that I should have touched upon is age. how the aging of the makers has affected the scene. does age equal disillusionment in this industry and hence my negative take on this subject? maybe- on the other side there are a lot of things worth being happy about.
Steven
28 Sep 10 at 12:33 pm
Interesting article Steven and I agree with a lot of it, but I’d like to add something here from the point of view of someone who runs a small independent brand. You talk about how brands should be “supporting the right independent stores, not going into the mainstream retailers, and only making your product available in select outlets”. The problem here is that the converse is also true, but no-one ever seems to mention it. For the most part, the independent stores themselves are not supporting independent brands properly. This is what has forced many brands with previously tight distribution to turn to more mainstream, larger retailers. Independent stores are struggling, the orders they place are shrinking and many of them simply do not pay on time. They’re also wary of ordering from less well-known brands simply because they’re not certain they can sell through the products.
Now obviously it’s not the fault of these independent stores that times are tough. And, of course, many of them are still doing a fantastic job and genuinely supporting their brands. But when you buy in a collection from a small independent clothing label and you still haven’t paid for it several months later, you are seriously fucking that brand. They need your money in order to pay their production costs. They do not have the capital to cushion themselves while they wait for you to pay. And so they have no choice but to turn to more mainstream retailers – often ones they would previously never have considered – simply because those bigger stores run their businesses better and are more likely to pay on time.
For most brands – though of course there are the greedy exceptions – it’s not a question of selling out. It’s not a question of chasing money. It’s just a question of keeping your head above water. I’ve known stores who make a big deal out of claiming to support independent streetwear but who have taken over a year to pay off their (small) debts. There are stores who take products on a sale-or-return basis, sell through completely and then still won’t pay the brand because they’ve used the money to pay off one of the larger companies who they’re more scared of losing as a supplier. If you’re Nike, you can threaten to stop supplying a store unless they pay on time. If you’re a small brand, you’ve got nothing to negotiate with.
Anyway, my point is that if you’re talking about ethics being thrown out the window then you need to take a hard look at the business practices of the streetwear stores, not just the brands. The responsibility goes both ways: what’s needed is mutual support.
The other side of the coin
28 Sep 10 at 12:56 pm
As always Steven, relevant! The concept of entropy in every state, the faster one grows, the faster one dies….
Le Messie
28 Sep 10 at 12:59 pm
@thothersideofthecoin
I couldn’t agree more, as a distributor of several brands this is a huge problem that I am more than painfully aware of, and you are absolutely right that I should have mentioned this also. thank you for pointing this out.
Steven
28 Sep 10 at 1:03 pm
From reading everyones response a lot of them missed/disregarded the social effect of the internet.
Take a look at all these blogs….a newbie can decide one day he wants to be a part of Streetwear, all he has to do now is follow a few select blogs and he knows everything he needs to know. 10 years ago you had to work hard for your knowledge.
We see these new kids and think streetwear is dead but its not its just became more accessible which is what streetwear was never about.
Your book asks a lot of people what Streetwear is and no one can define it, we all take from streetwear what we want. And i suppose thats the joy.
Ollie Danger
28 Sep 10 at 1:14 pm
“a newbie can decide one day he wants to be a part of Streetwear, all he has to do now is follow a few select blogs and he knows everything he needs to know. 10 years ago you had to work hard for your knowledge.”
ollie mate if it were up to you “being a part of streetwear” would require a secret password only few people know. you look at people and say to yourself he wearing clothes that was out of fashion 6 months ago, i pity you i really do
Maier, R
28 Sep 10 at 1:57 pm
@theothersideofthecoin
I have to agree. The stores can essentially dictate which brands will grow and which brands will die. And as far as I’m concerned a lot of them are doing a great job of making sure that the types of brands and mentalities that hurt streetwear’s “image” are continuing to grow.
It’s like there are two opposing forces right now. One pushing money and fame. And one pushing culture and integrity. It doesn’t matter if you have a blog, brand, store etc. What matters is why you’re here. The great part is you can choose which brands, blogs, stores etc. to follow or be associated with.
Derek Gusikoski
28 Sep 10 at 5:17 pm
In response to Steven’s post, my band Bad Dudes from Dude City will be going back to basics, releasing our own line of shirts and albums. We’re currently going to sell one (1) XL white ink on black fabric BD/DC shirt, and it will be available only via lottery.
The next album, being even more exclusive, will be released in 8 seconds snippets to scavenger hunt winners until they can all meet up at “Dudes Fest 2011″ to splice all of the snippets together. We will all listen to the album once and then destroy it.
It will be the rarest shit EVER.
Matt Barnette
28 Sep 10 at 9:52 pm
@matt
that’s a whole new sub genre of metalness right there
steven
28 Sep 10 at 10:04 pm
[...] response to Steven’s post, my band Bad Dudes from Dude City will be going back to basics, releasing our own line of shirts [...]
I Am Metal As Fuck. at Blacklodges
28 Sep 10 at 10:38 pm
[...] This post was mentioned on Twitter by Anwar Taj Washington, artBortolin, nsborg, Matthew Pantoja, Unequal Balance and others. Unequal Balance said: @suffocake Food for thought. Check it. RT @blacklodges Taking Stock of Street Culture in 2010. It's a long read beware http://bit.ly/bWAWQW [...]
Tweets that mention Street Culture in 2010. Taking Stock. at Blacklodges -- Topsy.com
29 Sep 10 at 3:25 am
[...] Black Lodges:Street Culture Part2 Check some of the comments as well. Couple of them have a good take on things. [...]
Been Awhile, Black Lodges « Reams Clothing
29 Sep 10 at 3:38 am
lol Streetwear as a term is still used? aI thought u guys gave up in 07/08. Seeing streetwear logos these days is embarrasing and depressing its like seeing people present day wearing FUBU from their glory days. How about all theseweak brands just throw in the towel so it won’t be so much of an overstturated joke! Posers ruined the scene man, the sad reality is its over
dykebeast
1 Oct 10 at 3:59 am
[...] “It all looked as if the streetwear movement from that time was going to be big” Excellent, thought-provoking article on why the latest streetwear wave failed to grow into a global and profitable youth movement. I do not fully agree with all things said but there’s some seriously interesting points made here, a must-read. [...]
SWURDIN | the linkout: week 39
2 Oct 10 at 11:33 am
you forgot to mention the biggest factor.
the majority of ’streetwear’ fuckin sucked.
simple as that
shit designs are shit designs are shit designs.
and they all deserved to die.
once kids got over the flash-in-the-pan hype it was over.
but the ‘brands’ didn’t know it. they were all under the false understanding that their shit was relevant because they sold units.
and now those ‘brands’ are complaining.
STFU.
This heritage fad will also die soon as a look.
But what you’ll see is constant business for the folks that create well designed and WELL BUILT clothing.
No the numbers won’t be there for various reasons. One being Kids won’t pay for quality. And another those that do won’t need to re-up each season for another button-up/jacket/pant ’cause the shit was built RIGHT.
hurts doesn’t it?
“The web 2.0 has destroyed any hope of ever again creating a truly global trend, especially in commercial terms”
This is nonsense btw. What do you call youtube? The fuckin iphone? the death of flash?
“In essence, what the web 2.0 has done is given every niche an equal right of existence. Democracy at it’s finest.”
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA again utter nonsense. Do you know what Google’s trying to do right now? Why people are protesting outside their HQ? Do you know how the Tea Party are and why they’re successful?
argh…
fuckstreetwear
2 Oct 10 at 2:04 pm
@thatguy . good point. the majority of streetwear sucked indeed and it was only natural it went away.
shame you had to get all personal in your rebuttals though, that was unnecessary.
youtube iphone etc sure, good point, it’s not a youth cultural trend though – and when i was writing this I was thinking in lines of music, clothing, arts – that’s a consumer good.
i’m all for commenting, but keep the comments respectable.
@dykebeast – don’t start a comment on here with lol. keep that idiocy somewhere else.
Steven
3 Oct 10 at 12:23 pm
This article takes itself (and streetwear) way too seriously. Culture is fluid, and it keeps moving. Very simple.
As long as public life exists, there will always be some form of ’street culture.’ You’re dating yourself by claiming the culture has somehow been corrupted and the potential for a real movement was lost via ’selling out.’ There was never a movement, nor any unified agenda; it’s always been business and the invisible hand.
There are still a lot of interesting people doing interesting things. They might not be online yet. Cheer up.
jammyland
4 Oct 10 at 6:58 am
“when i was writing this I was thinking in lines of music, clothing, arts – that’s a consumer good.”
Youtube is not a consumer good.
Regardless I believe one problem is the way you’re looking at things. You’re using antiquated ways to look at the situation. You need to be inclusive and contemporary. And see the age of the KIDS who spent all that money on the ‘new’ streetwear fad. They’re younger than you (n’ me) and their points of reference are completely different to your.
Music and arts are digested by the majority of KIDS nowadays via the internet. And clothing is the same.
That’s the way it is. And no KIDS are going to go back to the ol’ ways of doing. Why? Cuz they don’t know how to no more. Unless one of us ol’ folk guides ‘em.
Thank fuck streetwear is dead. We can get back rocking clothes without the associations to the KIDS.
HA.
“shame you had to get all personal in your rebuttals though, that was unnecessary.”
This is your personal soapbox. You get personal. The comments SHOULD be personal and challenging. Just like life.
Keep the hate alive.
fuckstreetwear
10 Oct 10 at 12:09 am
[...] Источник: blacklodges. [...]
Уличная культура, 2010 год — размышления Стивена Вогеля (Steven Vogel)
26 Nov 10 at 11:57 am